Stitching Stories: Mark Francis on the Sewing Bee, Mental Health and Doctor Who Fashion

In this episode of The Sewing Social podcast, host Gemma Daly sits down with Mark Francis, a fan-favourite contestant from The Great British Sewing Bee, for an inspiring conversation about creativity, confidence and cloth. 

Mark traces his sewing journey from early experiments at school to the national spotlight of the Sewing Bee, reflecting on the challenges of the competition and how the experience shaped both his self-belief and creative career.

The conversation explores the powerful connection between sewing and mental health, with Mark sharing how making became a source of calm, expression and resilience. 

He also dives into his love of Doctor Who fashion, discussing how sci-fi costume and storytelling influence his designs. 

Looking ahead, Mark reveals his future plans in the sewing world, including pattern design, commissions and creative projects, making this episode a must-listen for sewing enthusiasts, makers and fans of thoughtful, feel-good creativity.

Key Takeaways: 

• Mark Francis was a contestant on the Great British Sewing Bee in 2020.
• His interest in sewing began in school during home economics classes.
• Mark's husband Clive reignited his interest in sewing while preparing for their wedding.
• Sewing education in schools is often underfunded and lacks resources.
• Mark has been involved in community projects to teach sewing in underprivileged schools.
• He applied to the Sewing Bee after encouragement from Clive, despite only sewing for two years.
• The Sewing Bee experience helped boost Mark's confidence in his sewing skills.
• Mark's sewing patterns are inspired by his personal makes and the lack of menswear options.
• Doctor Who has significantly influenced Mark's design style and patterns.
• Mark continues to work on commissions and plans to teach and share his experiences at various events.

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Guest details: 

Website: www.sewmarkfrancis.com

Instagram: @sewmarkfrancis

Chapters:

00:00 Introduction to Mark Francis and His Sewing Journey

08:01 The Impact of Sewing Bee on Mark's Life

16:46 Mental Health and Sewing: A Personal Perspective

23:40 Mark's Pattern Business and Future Aspirations

25:56 Networking and New Ventures in Sewing

27:49 Doctor Who: A Lifelong Influence on Design

30:16 The Evolution of Doctor Who's Wardrobe

33:29 Current Projects and Future Plans

36:24 The Role of Social Media in Creative Work

44:19 Upcycling and Repurposing: A Sustainable Approach

46:27 Where to Find Mark: Connecting with the Community

47:18 Outro

Transcript

Gemma Daly (00:11)

Mark, welcome to the Sewing Social podcast. I'm so happy to have you on today.

Mark Francis (00:16)

Well, thank you for having me.

Gemma Daly (00:18)

You're welcome. Would you mind introducing yourself to the listeners?

Mark Francis (00:22)

Yeah, my name is Mark Francis. I was a contestant on the Great British Sewing Bee for Series 6 in 2020. And since then, I've gone to make a career out of working in the sewing industry, doing all kinds of making things for people, designing sewing patterns, live TV demonstrations, all kinds of

Gemma Daly (00:42)

exciting and we're going to touch on some of those lovely things today but first of all I would like to know what first sparked your interest in sewing and how did that grow over time?

Mark Francis (00:54)

The first spark was in school really, although it was like a lot of these home economics as we called it back in the 80s. It was usually pretty badly taught and organised and no fault of the teachers because Miss Hemming was lovely and I'm shocked to hear that she's still She was nudging retirement in the 80s. think she can possibly still be with us, but she is or she was last time I enquired But they did home economics.

and we were doing a cushion. And I could think of a million ways to make a cushion better than the process we were being taught. it's kind of, I enjoyed the process playing with the machine. I didn't understand any of didn't understand why the fabrics we weren't allowed to touch. Now I we did so little of it, but it did spark an interest. so we lived at home with my mom and dad and my grandpa as well. Now,

Mum and grandpa did do things like sewing and knitting and crochet, but only as a necessity. They weren't hobby sewists or knitters or whatever, as a lot of people are today. So if grandpa sewed, it was because something needed fixing. And that was the only reason. Or maybe making a costume for me, which was very rare. mum hated sewing. She did it all by hand. She absolutely loathed it. But it's only for mending, putting buttons on, putting tags into, into

clothes for school. Occasionally she might do something. She knitted me a Doctor Who scarf, much because of my nagging I think. I think those early days sparked an interest that didn't, nothing really happened for me personally until I was around 40 when the opportunity came my way to learn more.

Gemma Daly (02:29)

Okay, fantastic. And I have recently had your lovely husband Clive on the show. Did you learn from Clive or what was the situation there?

Mark Francis (02:40)

Clive did already sew, he's probably told you already, he was doing it from an early age. So by the time I met him, he was at a point where he could, he could sew but he hadn't done it for a number of years and he was a bit rusty and he was just getting back into it. And the wedding sparked that interest for him again, to brush up his skills. So we've got his machine out and making the dresses for bridesmaids and stuff. So it was kind of around that time the interest sparked again, but it was

because I couldn't do anything to help. could cut things out. I could fuse things, could press things and that was about it. But it started that interest again. And a few years after that, I went on some workshops as an introduction to sew to learn from the start, really. But we've always helped each other we do now. We sew different kinds of things, we make different kinds of things. So we could support each other and ask each other questions or advice or

we make things for each other as well. I'll make him shirts and things. So it's an evolving thing. He did try to teach me but he describes it as teaching your loved ones how to drive. Now I was taught to drive by my mother, which was pretty horrific.

Gemma Daly (03:39)

nice.

Yeah. Bless you. At school, you ever have any experiences about sort of being told that sewing was for girls or was that quite an open school that you went to and they were happy for everybody to learn?

Mark Francis (03:52)

Be comfortable.

No, I never heard the sewing is just for girls. I'm quite pleased to say I went to the same school as my brother and sister there a decade older than me. So they were at school in the 70s. I was at school in the 80s. So for what I can learn talking to them, the home economics sewing experience was very different in that decade. It got dumbed down, I suppose, whittled down to such a minimum.

So my sister Ruth, she made a pinafore dress. She did a beautiful piece. It's a piece of artwork that is a lady which she sewed the fabric onto canvas and she made this and put it into a frame. That's on the wall for years. It's beautiful piece of work. All this kind of stuff. And by the time we got there, we would did the cushion. But the cushion was two bits of fabric, which we sewed around the outside and we stuffed by leaving a hole and then we sewed it up. And that was it. That was the cushion.

Gemma Daly (04:55)

Yeah.

Mark Francis (04:56)

So I said earlier, I could think of a dozen different ways. We did a cushion on my introduction to sewing course. thought, oh, here we go. I've been here before. But we did an envelope cushion with buttonholes and covered buttons and an applique design and instructions to follow. So it was, I mean, we did it over one night and over three hours. did this wretched cushion at school for half a term or something. dragged its heels.

So it was intriguing, but it didn't teach you much.

Gemma Daly (05:27)

hopefully things have evolved a little bit from there, but I still think it's largely underfunded, isn't it? They're not teaching things that people would necessarily find useful, unfortunately.

Mark Francis (05:40)

Yeah, absolutely. Clive and I have done some work with a project in the Coventry and Warwickshire area which has had Arts Council funding to do sewing in schools, usually schools that were underprivileged and going in and doing different kinds of projects. So they were making dream catchers or turning jeans into bags, making portraits of themselves always something out of fabric, all this kind of stuff. But just getting them hands on with fabric, maybe with a sewing machine. Not all schools have sewing machines.

which is very sad. Some do and they work very hard to get the funding for those. So it was an enormous privilege to go in there and to be able to hopefully inspire them to be creative. That's what it's about. we're going to throw them saying you're going to be making a this whatever it might be, but they might find that they actually prefer doing something else creatively. And that's brilliant. it's getting that creative spark.

in them and encouraging them to keep that creative spark throughout their life. It's a really valuable tool, particularly as young people are growing up and going to further education to be able to still have this creative spark. It's actually a really valuable tool for future employers to to to nurture in general people is really valuable.

Gemma Daly (06:52)

Absolutely, what a lovely project to be involved in!

Mark Francis (06:55)

It was great

fun. We went to schools that I didn't even know existed all over the Coventry and Warwickshire area. they really lapped it up. usually at the end of, sort of once a year, they did an exhibition. They did some at the Dealer D'Arbush Centre in Coventry where they selected certain bits from the pupils to put on display and had big opening for all the parents to come along. It was absolutely great.

Gemma Daly (07:19)

So let's get on to the sewing bee, where a lot of people might know you from. How long had you actually been sewing before you applied to go on the show?

Mark Francis (07:30)

only two years actually at that point. So we filmed it in the autumn of 2019. yeah, I was about 40 in 2017. yeah, it's about, it's about two years. So Clive thought I should do it, which is very sweet. He, and he applied for me to do it. He, he saw in me, so he thought I could do it. He thought I should go and do this because he thought I was, I was good enough to do it. I would never have applied to do it. I don't think I'd even applied to do it now really.

Sometimes we have to be kicked down the alleyway to get something done, don't we? Clive's good at doing that for me. So I felt enormously on the back foot. But then when we get to know the other sewers, which we do as we go along, because we don't know who each other are, they deliberately keep us all in the dark as to who else is going on this journey with us until we actually meet.

And then you realize that Matt in my head had been sewing for two years and a few other people had as well. But then there's people like Therese and Claire who've been sewing all their lives since they were small girls. And it's quite second nature to I think the sewing bee's strength is that it is people experiences, sewing and different backgrounds and different approaches to their craft and to what they do. I make menswear.

Claire makes ladies wear, Liz made underwear and basques and bras and things, that's how she got into sewing and stuff and lots of other things. Alex, who's was in our year, he made dance wear. So this does create a strange kind of level playing field because one week I'll have to think, yes, I could do this. And other times I'm oh, God, I haven't got the faintest idea of what I'm doing here. And that might be the opposite for somebody else.

Gemma Daly (09:12)

That's right. you think there's a specific challenge or garment that particularly sticks with you even now?

Mark Francis (09:19)

or in a good way or a bad way.

Gemma Daly (09:20)

Either way, let's do both!

Mark Francis (09:22)

So for the transformation round was the bit I was really not looking forward to. I didn't really know how to practice So I just have to go in cold really. The first week or so was pretty horrific, but you kind of get into a bit of a rhythm with it. But one week we had to make any garment out of laundry bags, anything at all, male, female, anything we like. And I just had to make a trench coat.

which I got set in sleeves, patch pockets and vented back, all this kind of stuff in 90 minutes. And I was really pleased with don't have time to look what other people are making, but you do when they're all lined up and you look at them and that's very good and that's very good and that's not so good. And you kind of have a rough idea where you might come in the ranking. And I came really low, so I was really cross. The only time I got really grumpy about they didn't quite see.

the work that was going in and marked it appropriately. The only time I did get grumpy at there's nothing that you can do it's just tele, it doesn't really matter, but inside I was a bit cross. But since that garment's been on display a number of times since then, people remember it and they really enjoyed it. And they were always surprised like me that it didn't fare better. So it's kind of been vindicated in a way because ⁓

Gemma Daly (10:33)

You

Mark Francis (10:34)

Everybody else loves it and Patrick and Esme didn't. They wanted something more structural apparently. I don't know whether you get more structural than a trench coat with set in do I know? So that was probably the lowest I was really pleased with the bomber jacket, which we made out of old clothes. We had, I think it was three garments we had to choose from all these things. They took all the fabric out of the haberdashery and had lots of clothes hanging up.

Gemma Daly (10:41)

⁓

Mark Francis (10:59)

we could pick three garments and I made this bomber jacket. for me it's kind of a heads down and get on with it. You are making telly, so you've got to talk to the sewing producers and the producers and various other people as it comes But I was kind of doing my own thing and then I won it. I won that particular, which I wasn't expecting at all.

I the only person that got the jersey ribbing around the neck in correctly it seems. I think that's why I won. I think that they did ask me how I did it. I just followed the instruction isn't terribly helpful. But the others, you're doing these things quickly. This is what you have to remember with a programme It's like sewing big or any program of a similar nature, very proper throw down.

the game of wool at the moment. You're doing things really quickly and so it's not necessarily your best work or the way you do it and you haven't got time to correct mistakes because we all make things that go wrong or there's bits that we have to unpick and do again to one degree or another and you don't get time. I figured it's pretty early on if you stop and get stuck on a particular stage for too long

Gemma Daly (11:41)

Yeah.

Mark Francis (12:02)

you won't get to the end and you won't finish and then Esme will go well it's such a shame you didn't finish and then you'll be at the bottom

Gemma Daly (12:09)

it's such a hard thing to balance, isn't it? Like, speeding through it, even if you know it's not quite your best, but then if you don't finish, you know, you're not gonna get marked well, so it's a toss-up.

Mark Francis (12:20)

Yeah,

Peter in our year we were making a basque and he forgot to put the two back panels on. They were left on his bench and he didn't notice this until he went to put it on the mannequin when there's a there's a great big kind of six inch eight inch gap and it wouldn't get in on the mannequin. He'd put the hook and I say been beautifully onto the side panels but not onto the Everything else he made was really, really good. But

missed off his two panels. So because of this he was right at the bottom. yeah, mine was kind of fair to middling. I had, it's the strip of hook and I was like a long, a long thing. How you get into it yourself is a mystery. You must distance. And how you set it on, I just look at the instructions thinking, I haven't got the faintest idea what I'm supposed to do with this. I gave it a bit of a best guess. I did think

ask Liz, Liz makes all her own underwear, she must know how this goes on and she went I don't know what this is trying to tell us to do but I'm doing it this way but mine wasn't right but it functioned. It's half the battle.

Gemma Daly (13:19)

Yeah.

That's it, that's it. Can you think of maybe one sort of behind the scenes moment that Sewing Bee fans might be interested to hear about or surprised to hear about?

Mark Francis (13:35)

so I was reading recently about the process of filming some other similar programs, Drag Race, they do all their episodes back to back. that they no break, virtually no break all the way through, which must be just exhausting. We filmed two days for each episode, which is kind of how you see it. It is actually two days. So the first day we do the pattern, challenge and transformation.

The second day we'll do the, the mate to measure. And there's lots of these little cafe scenes and little kind of all having a break and stuff, which are sometimes it's a real break other times that something which has been concocted. So we used to go around to this little cafe around the corner from the Premier Inn, was we from the Burden series, around the corner and this little park, the tennis courts, there's a little cafe. It looked like a cafe to me in the corner. The film was walking in a number of times.

The film was leaving a number of times. They filmed us eating pastries and having coffees. Then the film was having sandwiches and water. Why we couldn't have coffee with our sandwich, I don't really know. And we had to do general chit chat and quiet contemplation on all these different things. And then we'd cut off and we'd go and do what we actually came to do, which was the sewing. And I was thinking, this is a jolly nice cafe. I could come here with Clive afterwards to reminisce.

And then I realised it wasn't a cafe at all. This little hut in the corner of a park in London was actually a really expensive Michelin star restaurant that was doing kind of like fancy steak and chips about 70 pounds a head. They say, oh, I don't think I'll be coming here. The coffees did come from the cafe, but the pastries and the sandwiches all came from Tescos.

And as soon as we finished, we'd already had breakfast. So this was about 8 o'clock in the morning. Then we had breakfast. Then we eating pastries and sandwiches or whatever we needed for the shot. And then the crew would just ascend on it and pick over like scavengers, picking over anything else. But they've slot this kind of stuff in as they needed it. And they still do it now, but not in the very different place now. They're in Leeds. So I think it's actually a corner of their studio right from what I can see.

make out that we did these cafe scenes. It's kind of, it's a bit of theatre of television. There wouldn't be time in the day for us to have that at the appropriate time when it appears because you'd have to take the cameras out the studio and de-rig everything and go down the road and it would take too long. So it's best to do it the first thing while we're not quite awake.

Gemma Daly (15:57)

you

Little behind the scenes snippets there, that's cool. How do you think being on the show sort of shaped your confidence or your approach to sewing afterwards?

Mark Francis (16:15)

I think the program has, it's a kind of atmosphere where you're just thrown into doing you can't say no, least I don't think we can say no. I don't know if I should try that actually, maybe I should. But you have to just go on and do it. And it says you're making a basque and I'm in my head, I haven't got the first idea what I'm doing with this. I've never heard anything like it. And you look at to the end of four hours to think, you know what, that's not bad. And in that way, it does give you

an enormous amount of confidence just to go in and do it, just to throw yourself into these things, challenge yourself do things that you don't even want to do in a way. It's a strange world filming anyway, it's long days, it's hard work, it's a lot of fun at the same you can't switch off for that hour day that you might be doing with me for 14 hour days.

You have to be kind of switched on and on the ball. So you just have to go with it and you just have to do it. that in itself you confidence. And there's no one else, there's no backups to help you. There's no YouTube, you haven't got your you can't Google anything. You just have to go with it and trust your instincts and ask, maybe ask your new friends. seems to be a formula that works for a lot of these programs.

and it can give you a lot of confidence. Of course, different contributors or contestants on this have different experiences of By and large, everybody, from what I can make out, has a good positive experience. Sewing Bee do a lot to look after us. I was having a bit of a rough time personally with work at the time and they actually paid for counselling for me while I was involved in the production.

there's a lot of care that goes into it. Some people don't feel that way. Some people find it very stressful and very difficult and much less enjoyable, is very sad. But from what I can account, most people do really enjoy it.

Gemma Daly (18:10)

that's good. And I want to touch on a little bit about, you know, your mental health, Mark, because we've met each other in person a couple of times at different shows and you sort of said to me a little bit about mental health and sewing. Is there a link there for you?

Mark Francis (18:15)

Mm.

yeah, there is. It's very important, I think, for the people and there's a lot of people for various different reasons struggle with mental health, or what's that what's something that pops in and out of our lives, to different degrees, or through our lives. important to have those escapes, those things you can go to. doesn't necessarily mean

I walk into the sewing room and suddenly there's a heavenly glow and everything's right with the world. Because sometimes you can be doing it and you're cursing and everything's going wrong and you your work across the room. And other times it can take you out of that place of where you are in your head. And hopefully you can put your brain power, it will tunnel into the task you've got in hand.

When I was filming Sewing Bee, I was working in the bank still and not having a particularly good time. And I did leave before the programme actually went to air. a couple of months after you finished filming, actually, I left. But I've been there for 20 odd years. So something I've done for a long Didn't enjoy it anymore. Didn't know what else to do. 20 years in a job like that, you can feel a little bit trapped. My dad would slightly unhelpfully go,

there's a job here at the Building Society, that doesn't help dad, that's just more of the same. I to do something else. So sewing be, gave me confidence, we talked about earlier, to be able, particularly to be able to go and do something else and to make a career out of working in the sewing industry. That's taken a few years to build up and I was doing other things in the meantime, just regular other jobs.

A lot of the mental health at that point in my life was due to work, work related stress. Corporate and banking don't always get it. They don't always deal with it in the right way. Quite often you're a bit of a number. There's a tick box I heard all kinds of cliches from my line manager at the time that now I look back was monumentally unhelpful.

And although they did the whole of come and sit down, let's have a chat. They weren't actually interested in me personally. They were interested in when I'll be able to perform at a standard that they find acceptable. And sometimes you can't do But I realised and you think that's over. When will this will end at some point? My my mood I'm in will finish and then I'll be back to how I was before.

and that doesn't happen. realised that doesn't happen. You only go forward and you can't remove what's happened it stays with you.

Yeah, it stays with you and you don't want it. It's like an unwelcome friend that's kind of there with you all the time. it's hopefully you can get the help that can get you through those moments. So yeah, I've been on antidepressants for quite some years on and off that go up and down. Usually don't stop, but they have done from time to time. And that's really hard as well. You don't want this. You just want to be as you were. But that person's gone.

and it's kind of a grief for that person in a way.

Gemma Daly (21:27)

Absolutely. it's really good of you to share that with us because, you know, that's very personal. But it's also great that you recognise that there was an issue and that sewing is actually like a mindful task because you said like you go in there, it doesn't take the problems away, but it helps you to focus on a different task and you can be mindful. So that's, it's really

important thing to discuss isn't it?

Mark Francis (21:56)

And Sewing Bee during this particular period, were really brilliant. There's one episode, I think it's about episode five, and I was having a particularly tough time. of the filming schedule, I still working between, so two days filming, two days back at work, then I was back filming again. was ping ponging up and down between Warwickshire and London continuously for about six or eight weeks while this was going on. And my

boss was good enough to give me the time off I needed for the filming schedule, I had to work in between. So I was, I was all over the place, geographically and in a way mentally as well. And on this particular occasion, I've had an awful two hour meeting about how I wasn't performing and stuff. And I've gone straight from that to the train station down to London to do the filming and I hadn't had a chance to kind of offload this or talk to Clive about it or anything.

and we'd all gone a bit much during the filming and I got really quite upset. But Sewing Bee paid for Clive to come down to London to be with me and stay there from the hotel and then pay for him to go back the next day to be there with me. So he got a little insight as to this little funny little world that we were, this very odd world that we were living in.

Gemma Daly (23:09)

Yeah, but that is really good of the show to recognise that you were struggling and to actually do something about it, isn't it?

Mark Francis (23:17)

Yeah, I was trying to keep it all in, but I couldn't manage it. I went to have a quiet cry to myself. In the green room slash student flat, it wasn't posh at all. There was like a curtain there where they were keeping all kinds of other stuff. And I just went around there just to be by myself and to get the tears out, I suppose. And all the other bees came around and were being really lovely and comforting me. And then, of course, this gets back to the production team.

and they were great. Patrick was wondering why I was quite upset. He was probably thinking it was them, but it wasn't anybody they did at all. They were brilliant.

Gemma Daly (23:53)

well I'm glad there was a positive outcome to that anyway. Let's get on to your patterns, your business that you've created since the show. What inspired you to go down that route and start creating patterns?

Mark Francis (24:09)

So following Sewing Bee, you go in it just to have fun. There was no game plan. I didn't have a business plan or career plan to have afterwards. One or two of the bees sometimes do have that in mind if they're mindful enough to think of that. I just tend to go with the flow. And it occurred to me during filming, maybe this could go somewhere. But I didn't really know where. You get a funny limbo between the two.

We'd finished filming in October. We didn't go out until the April. I was doing one of my, I playing the piano and I played for, or used to at the time, play for wedding fairs to try and get to the business to play the piano at people's weddings. I was playing at one of my regular wedding fairs and there was another musician there which shocked me because I was usually, it's my gig and musicians, music wise. I went to have a talk to her and she was the wedding singer but she also was a presenter on, it doesn't exist now but it was sewing quarter.

which came and from that went on to Sewing Street, the shopping channel. she was saying, well, I'm a presenter on Sewing Quarter. I should talk to you. I think in my head I'm not supposed to, but I should. So I did divulge to her what I've just been doing. And she said, you must come on. I would love to have you on Sewing Quarter. thought, great. we exchanged emails. And then Sewing Quarter went out of business. Thought, that's the end of that.

Gemma Daly (25:06)

⁓ yeah.

Mark Francis (25:26)

But then by further coincidence, I got to know John Scott, who is a presenter on Sewing Street. And randomly via Facebook, just the algorithms putting it, think we should know each other for some reason. And I actually got chatting again, and this all started from there. So I started to do live TV demos for Sewing Street. And they were interested to see if I was going to have any of my own products out, which had occurred to me that I could.

then I started to work on the sewing patterns. And then it's just from there you get, when you're in this industry, you kind of meet people that do different kinds of things and you think, oh gosh, that's great. And you get involved and they get you a gig or you get them a gig and you recommend each other. So from there I got involved with a lady called Wendy Gardner, who was a presenter on Sewing Street at the time. She happens to work for Knitting and Stitching shows as well. So I got involved in doing stuff for that. So opens all these different doors just from this one little

chance meeting with Vicki Carroll at a wedding fair back in 2019. The sewing patterns come from all different places. They usually start as things I've made for myself. That's usually how it starts. My interest particularly is in menswear. That's what I tend to stick to. I don't feel I've got anything new to add to ladieswear because there are so many patterns out there for ladies.

uncountable number of variations of all these different things. I think I'd be a, don't think I'd be able to hit the mark on But menswear I could, because there's so little variation in the commercial sewing patterns for menswear. If once you've got past scrubs and pajamas and a shirt, then they're usually out of ideas. I tried to things which are a little bit different. And that's how that's how they came about.

Gemma Daly (27:09)

How would you describe your style, Mark? does, you make as a pattern, does that influence your style or vice versa?

Mark Francis (27:18)

So there's a thread running through my life, which is Doctor Who, the BBC TV series. And that's, I've watched that since all my life. My brother's 10 years older than me, he was watching it. That's why I started to watch it. that influences lot of things that I do. So some of the patterns have inspiration from that as a starting point, something I've seen somewhere else. It might be a neckline or a

cuff or a bit of this, that, and the other, you think, oh, I like that. Let's work with that. Let's play with that. Sometimes the patterns come from commissions I do. So I make a lot of Doctor Who replica costumes for people. And that quite often designing it from the ground up. And once you've done all that work, you've got this pattern. You might as well get it graded and release it for other people to enjoy.

good thing with a series like Doctor Who is not a hero in a a in a onesie with a cape and some red pants, which is great if you like that kind of thing. It's a different style altogether. So there's different inspirations from the past and visions of the future and present day stuff to really get your teeth into it. And when you start reading it and researching it and seeing where the ideas come from, and what the

Gemma Daly (28:18)

Thank

Mark Francis (28:32)

designers are trying to do when they're starting to have a development team. It's really very interesting.

Gemma Daly (28:37)

It sounds interesting and it obviously spans a lot of different eras and things like you say. Now I am not a Doctor Who fan and I don't claim to know much about it but I'm interested to know which doctor's wardrobe inspires you the most and why.

Mark Francis (28:55)

Some of the doctors have quite a variation of things. They have designers that have things, oh gosh, let's give them a new waistcoat or a new this, that, and the other for this production. they get quite a nice variation. So you see this time in the title role. So one that does that quite nicely is actually John Pertwee and Tom Baker who filled a whole of the John Pertwee, you get this, this is a third doctor.

It was all designed in the late 60s, so it's all male peacocking. Mr. Fish shirt, Mick Jagger, all this kind of stuff. you don't get the male peacocks anymore, but people would, the guys would dress just immaculately. And something along the lines of what we now see as John Whitman's third op, a velvet jacket, a frilly shirt, maybe a big fancy hat, which John didn't wear as the role, but that kind of idea.

So you see how they developed that over the five years he was in the role, how that they find a little area that they like in design and they play with it. And the shirts that John Pertwee had were quite nuts. They had zips and huge collars and frills everywhere. And then they settle into a bit of a rhythm of a later design. Tom Maker does the same. were going for, this was 1974 by this point. So the male peacocking was over, really.

So it was more of a student kind of Bohemian kind of vibe. It's all a bit baggy and a bit scruffier. So there was tweed trousers and a corded jacket. But it's got a kind of an Edwardian kind of vibe, but in this kind of mid-70s studenty kind of feel. So the hair's bigger and there's a big hat and stuff. And they play with it over the next seven years. And it gets a bit more Victorian. And then it gets a little bit.

or something else towards the end, they do play with that and how they play with that is really interesting. How they'll, as an example, they'll give them a new shirt. It looks like a Victorian shirt, but it's actually got, it's based on a modern design block. So it's made like a modern shirt with Victorian bits and pieces on it, but they've made all these specially for it. seeing that and how that has been influenced by current trends at the time.

is really enriched and how that in itself goes on to influence design. How many times do we see, it's a number of times now, over the last decade, since the 70s, we've seen long scarves come in and out of fashion. And it's always linked back to this particular design. Because one knitter who was asked to make a scarf for Doctor Who didn't know when to stop. It wasn't supposed to be that long. That wasn't the idea.

They just thought, he should have a scarf maybe. And they said to this knitter, Begonia Pope her name was, here's some colours seven different colours that the designer had chosen. You must use all the colours. Now what she did was use all the wool. So they had a scarf that was 22 foot long, which was not the idea. But Tom Baker thought this was absolutely nuts and he loved it. But they cut it down to about 12 foot to make it it's not so incoherently.

Gemma Daly (31:49)

my goodness.

Mark Francis (31:59)

dangerous to to wap. But this became a complete fluke and an accident became his part of his signature look.

Gemma Daly (32:00)

Yeah.

It is really interesting actually, I think I need to go and look at a few pictures of these different eras and have a look at things.

Mark Francis (32:15)

it does get influenced by fashion. Matt Smith was more recently having kind of the geek chic look, which wasn't a thing until he did And it's actually Matt Smith's ideas and I could, they tried all kinds of things, which if you Google it, you'll see pictures of and they're completely wrong and not right in the slightest. They're trying too hard. But he just goes, well, why don't you just wear a bow tie and a tweed jacket and

Gemma Daly (32:20)

Mmm.

Mark Francis (32:42)

producers all screw their faces up and said okay let's just humane we'll try it and then they go actually that's the one and from there it sparked this whole geek chic tweed jacket kind of slightly nerdy look as a fashion trend.

Gemma Daly (32:55)

Amazing! Who knew that Doctor Who was so influential? Who knew? So do you have any exciting plans coming up, Mark?

Mark Francis (32:59)

Who knew in... Who knew?

Yeah, well, the, the commissions keep coming in. So this is the backbone of what I do really, I do lots of things. When you're self employed, you have to don't you? So I do lots of talks, talking about my time on the Sewing Bee, I go all over the country doing those for W.I's and quilting groups and anybody, anybody else who wants to really, I do the shows, work like knitting and stitching show, creative craft shows, Sewing for Pleasure. I'll be at Sewing for Pleasure in March. That's the next one I'm doing.

Gemma Daly (33:16)

Mm.

Mark Francis (33:34)

teaching, the catwalk show, we're doing the proud lounge again, and we'll be there setting our patterns and all our usual bits and pieces. But throughout the rest of the year I'm doing commissions and it's mostly Dr Who replica costumes. And like we've been saying, a large amount of research goes into this.

people say can you make me this. My first thought is crikey and but I can't say no so I go with it say yeah I'd love to. Then I start to think gosh can I do this? I haven't made this before, can I get the fabric? So there's it starts this whole process of research. This is something I know a lot about there's a lot of stuff in there already but you think I need to get these details right so what is it? Is it still about? Can I see the garments in question?

Has it been an exhibition? Does it even exist anymore? Can I get to see it? Does a friend of I've got friends who own bits and pieces these days, because I've got to know people in the industry and they'll and they might own it. And in which case, can I get a pattern from it? Occasionally, I can do that. Not very often. Or it might be me and photographs, which is it usually is, eyeballing it and scratching my head and playing with it till I get it right. And there's a mixture of research between

what I can see in the pictures and what I can see on the episodes and what my brain tells me should be going on if I was making it. Because what you see isn't necessarily the whole picture. You can't see everything. This is lit for telly. It might be dark. The photographs are quite not taken for reference purposes. They're production stills or publicity stills. So there's a lot of logic and sewing logic and tailoring logic.

would I make this coat? What should it be doing? How should it be made? Have they done that? Have they done something else? Have they bought it? Can I find it in the shop? You know, that kind of stuff. Has it been made from scratch? Really interesting work. So I've just finished a tailcoat, waistcoat and shirt, which for Doctor Who fans is the future of Doctor. If look at my socials, you'll see it on there. But it could be by the time you've watched this, I've done something else even more exciting.

Gemma Daly (35:41)

That's it. That's it. Well, I think that's incredible what you do, because I would be absolutely petrified of doing that kind of work. So yeah, big round of applause for that.

Mark Francis (35:41)

So it just keeps going.

Social media is brilliant at this kind of thing because you can make something and put it out there and then sometimes people will say, oh gosh, can you make me one as well? So sometimes I make things for myself and say, can I have one? And that's great. that's kind of the really lovely part of social media. There is a whole ugly side to it as well, of course. And in a way, it's a necessary evil these days to get our work

the creatives noticed. But if you use it the right way, it can really work in your favor.

Gemma Daly (36:25)

That's it, absolutely. So just to tie up the interview mark, I like to play a little game of this or that. Are you up for it? Yeah? So an organized stash or creative chaos?

Mark Francis (36:32)

Okay. Yeah, definitely.

gosh, I think I'm somewhere between the two actually. My stash is organised but it's also quite messy as well. So I'll just yank something off the shelf from the velvet and then it'll go, oh god, I can't get it in there. So I just stuff it back on the top. And it was sort of, think, oh, I really need to go through this again, don't I? It's got so messy. There's a shelf which I keep stuff on, which I've just bought, I put it on the shelf there, it's in the sewing room, I might use it very soon. And then two years later, I I need to go and it needs to go away.

Gemma Daly (36:42)

You

you

Mark Francis (37:08)

I'm you say that.

Gemma Daly (37:10)

Do want to know what Clive said about you? He said, definite chaos.

Mark Francis (37:12)

I don't know what did he say. He probably doesn't really mess with me.

No, look,

the thing is, when you're working, I'm not thinking about hoovering up all the bits on the floor. Whenever it's swapping, think it's really messy on the carpet. I need to actually go in there and give this a bit of a tidy up, which I have do. And I clogged the hoover up. I found another use for the ruleau loop thing with the stick with the little tiny hook on the end. Really good at unclogging the vacuum.

Gemma Daly (37:39)

tip there for everybody.

so making for yourself or others.

Mark Francis (37:45)

god, this is not, I'm not very good at giving this or that answers, am I? if you're doing something you love as a career, and it was a hobby, you've got to keep the hobby part of it going. So I do make for myself, and I love making for myself. I also love making for my customers as well. That is also what keeps the roof over our heads in a practical sense also. So if I was just making for customers,

I think I might after a while grow to resent it and it just becomes a job. I don't want it to become a job. I want it to say something I love. So I'll make things and I make things for me and other people who I love because I want to and because it makes me happy. And I don't care if I have 20 coats because I'm going to make a

Gemma Daly (38:28)

that's good answer. Wovens or knits?

Mark Francis (38:32)

woven, I think. I don't do an awful lot with knitted fabric with like jerseys and stuff. Although I do want some more Henley t-shirts, which the ones in my drawer have been there for about a decade and I've gotten from H&M And they're still going, but they're looking a bit sad now. And I've been looking at buying some more, but part of me gets a bit kind of, no, I don't need to buy it. I should make it, but it's knitted. It's jersey. So do have jerseys on the shelf.

I think I have a sewing pattern and I have thread. So I just need to put all of those three things together, don't I? But it's stretchy and wobbly. It's stretchy and wobbly and I've got to deal with it.

Gemma Daly (39:04)

You can do it, you can do it. Do you... Sorry. ⁓

It's not, it's easy. You'll whizz that up in no time.

Mark Francis (39:12)

I hope so.

Gemma Daly (39:16)

Do you prefer scissors or a rotary cutter?

Mark Francis (39:19)

do you know, it depends what I'm cutting out. I do use both at different times. I do default to the rotary, but sometimes it won't get through it. I'm doing, I was doing an Inverness cape recently in a Melton wool and it was not having I had to get the scissors out. But then the rotary can be good for going around those awkward corners, whereas scissors can be a bit cumbersome sometimes. Scissors, I feel, is a skill.

to them correctly, to your fabric out neatly. It's not just hacking away, you're not cutting up something for sticking and gluing. You've to cut it neatly, hopefully. So I feel that sometimes I think I should use the scissors because I need to practice that more to get that better.

Gemma Daly (39:47)

Mm.

good point. Tea or coffee?

Mark Francis (40:03)

But you know, my default answer is tea, although I do like a cup of coffee as well. We've got a coffee machine. Well, we got a coffee machine. I got Clive a coffee machine for his birthday. Of course, it's the house So that's the new latest fun thing. Let's have a posh coffee. I do like a coffee plunger, cafetiere thing in the morning. take breakfast in bed. And we have breakfast in bed upstairs.

Gemma Daly (40:14)

You

Mark Francis (40:28)

every morning, But I'd always make you think of my dad who for 40 years took breakfast to my mum and going, there's your breakfast and walked out the room again. So I do it with love. I do it because I want to rather than it being.

Gemma Daly (40:37)

Aww.

Yeah,

that's nice. Spring, summer or autumn, winter?

Mark Francis (40:46)

Autumn, winter, think I much prefer to wrap up warmer rather than have to layers off. And everything looks nice with a nice big coat, especially if it's something you've made yourself. I do like making a coat. Clive thinks I've got too many, but you can work. Like today, I've got a waistcoat on. This is upcycled from a skirt. is actually my sailor shirt pattern, but I've chopped the collar off of it that's less sailor-y.

but it's in a double gauze. And I can put a nice coat on them, like we were swishing down the road with a dog. This was actually inspired by Doctor Who. There's a reason I picked this velvet. So Tom Baker had a waistcoat in 1980. It's got this kind of abstract floral design in, it's mostly kind of purples and reds and bits of gold in there. But because of the production, you can't quite see it. You can never quite see it. And it's tucked away in a private collection, so no one's really seen it. And you think...

fabric must be about somebody must own a bit of this fabric somewhere in their stash and then I do research and I've realised they haven't because they bought a vintage fabric in 1980 and they bleached it and they dyed it and they over dyed it and they did this that and the other until they got what they wanted so this was this was something I sort of thought you know what that's pretty similar so I made one out of a skirt

Gemma Daly (41:54)

Wow.

Amazing, Would you prefer for your bobbin never to run out or for your needle never to break?

Mark Francis (42:08)

Hmm needles do go with a bang don't they when they go it finds a life after It makes me jump and if Clive's in the room, he'll he'll be cursing because of What have I done now used was I've left the pin in the way It can be frustrating for bobbins to run out as well. That happened to me last night I Think needles never to break because I I don't like the shock. I can't cope with shocks these days. I'm too delicate

Gemma Daly (42:31)

think I would pick that one as well because it is noisy. Do you prefer prints or solids?

Mark Francis (42:39)

It's mixing them in the right way, it? Probably solids, I think.

But prints, it's working out how to use it. the best way, depends what the print is really, doesn't it? Gosh, yeah, I think solid, because you can have a lot of fun with that.

Gemma Daly (42:51)

You

Mark Francis (42:56)

I got a skirt recently from the Quilt Stitch Social down the road in Walton Hill in the Wirral. They were having a fabric de-stash, five pound a bag. So I filled seven bags. One of them was an old skirt. It's purple and mustard and tartan. I think it's just like a fashion. I don't think it's a proper tartan, just like a fashion But they cut it.

Gemma Daly (43:15)

Wow.

Mark Francis (43:17)

on the bias. there's, I'm now thinking what can I do? So I dismantled it the other night and I've washed it and it's quite, it's below the knee level it would have been and it's quite flared. So there's lots of fabric in it. So usually skirt equals waistcoats. Is that, what else can I get out of? Can I have lapels? How many pockets can I do? Can I do the back out of the same fabric? Endless.

Gemma Daly (43:30)

Ooh.

Amazing and is upcycling something that you do like to do? Repurposing those garments or fabrics?

Mark Francis (43:48)

I do. And this is something I'm doing more with my own makes as well recently. you buy a thing, a garment from the shops, you wear it for however long you wear it, and then you hoof it out. It goes down the charity shop, you give it away, whatever. You sell it on Vinted perhaps. But if you've made something yourself, you're a bit less inclined to get rid of it. You think of all the hours you put into it. I mean, it's much more difficult to get rid of it. So now I'm thinking, should I sell it?

or can I use it for something else? So I made one of my very first makes of certainly the first thing I drafted was a sleeved cape coat. You might call it a swing coat if you So it's the cape with sleeves essentially. And I drafted it myself and I've worn it for the last six years or something. And I've realised it's getting quite tatty now, partly because I didn't know what I was doing, mostly when I was making it and I can make them a lot better now. So I recently cut it up and making a shacket

it's here actually. This isn't planned. But it just happens to be, because I tried it on my site. this is the tweed and I added in velvet, just to, I needed a bit more fabric. And I going through my stash and I found different bits of lining. It's got patch pockets. It's kind of nearly there. I've got some tweaking and this and that to do to it and stuff. But yeah, so that's something I've upcycled, And yeah, I'm upcycling skirts as well.

Gemma Daly (44:46)

You

That's so cool.

Wow.

it's lovely.

Mark Francis (45:13)

the velvet skirt thing to waistcoat started because a customer said to me, can you make me this particular waistcoat of Tom Baker's from 1978? went, yeah, I'd love to, but nobody sells brown paisley velvet. Just not fashionable, it's not on the market, you can't get it. So then I scratched my head thinking, well, I could upcycle something, because I've got a skirt, and I did that. And then of course, someone else has to make me one, and the answer is, well, yes and no. I can, but I've got to find

Gemma Daly (45:39)

Yeah.

Mark Francis (45:40)

another skirt or one similar. But it gives people a unique piece. the chance of finding another one like this is quite slim. So I know I'm the only one like this. And that's quite special.

Gemma Daly (45:48)

Mmm.

That's lovely. Really great. So where can people find you, Mark?

Mark Francis (45:56)

everywhere.

Sew Mark Francis or sew Mark Francis, or if you just Google Mark from the great bit of sewing bee, because there's only been me and someone in series two called Mark so far. I'm easy to find it seems. So Mark Francis is my website and my social media.

Gemma Daly (46:15)

Perfect. And like you said earlier, you'll be at the Sewing for Pleasure show in March. Is that right?

Mark Francis (46:21)

I will Sewing for pleasure in March, I've got various talks next year booked in. So if you're lucky enough, one of the groups, I can't remember which one's they are off the top of my head, But if you're in a group and you want to book me, can and I can come along to where you are. We can do it on Zoom, a bit like Yeah, that's the next place to see me.

Gemma Daly (46:36)

Perfect, well you've been amazing Mark! Thank you so much for joining me on the Sewing Social Podcast today.

Mark Francis (46:42)

Thank you for having me.

Gemma Daly (46:44)

You're welcome. You take care. Bye.

Mark Francis (46:46)

Bye bye.